From: Lynn McIntosh [faiml@uswest.net] Sent: Tuesday, October 17, 2000 2:06 AM To: FAIMLanon; FAIML Cc: faiml@uswest.net Subject: FAIML #472; Oct. 16, 2000 Ferret Adrenal/Insulinoma Mailing List (FAIML) #472; Oct. 16, 2000 Hi there! Thanks to those who replied about the "squares" in posts. Apparently they aren't too bothersome to anyone, plus I got one so very cute message about them that they will ever make me smile when I see them. I'll fiddle around with settings, though, and it's probably time for another software upgrade, which could help, or could make things worse. Our CA person in the Bay area still hasn't had a close enough referral. I've referred her to the Ferrets Anonymous site, and also suggested posting in the FML, but if you have other ideas of vets please send them to me and I'll forward them to her. It's hard enough finding a vet in Seattle! I really feel for those in CA where are sweet fuzzies are still illegal. Talk to you later :) Lynn There are twelve messages in today's list: Northern NJ vet needed ASAP Cardiomyopathy and insulinoma Adrenal Question Jonesy Proglycem and Pred. Update on Odo Chicken baby food and glucose levels CA Vet: no luck finding one in Bay area yet... Northern NJ vet needed ASAP Northern NJ vet needed ASAP Northern NJ vet needed ASAP Northern NJ vet needed ASAP FERRET ADRENAL/INSULINOMA MAILING LIST (FAIML) is a list featuring support and information about adrenal and insulinoma diseases. It comes out in digest format three to six times per week, depending on the urgency and number of posts. It is the opinion, only, of subscribers, and is not intended as medical advice, comes with no guarantee of accuracy, and is not meant to replace the examination and medical oversight of a qualified veterinarian. If your ferret is exhibiting signs of illness please take him or her to the most ferret-experienced vet you can. A ferret-experienced vet is one of the most important services you can provide for your ferret. TO POST: Write POST at the end of your subject heading (the more specific you can be in your subject heading, the better) and send to . URGENT POSTS: If you feel the message is urgent please mark it POST URGENT and I'll send it out to subscribers as soon as I can, then include the message in the next list. CALIFORNIA RESIDENTS: Please write POST ANONYMOUS after your subject heading if you don't want your address or last name published. SUBSCRIBE/UNSUBSCRIBE: Just use the one address for posts, subscription questions, requests, cancellations, comments, etc. The list is run by hand so just send me an email. ADRENAL/INSULINOMA WEBSITE and FAIML ARCHIVES/PHOTOS: For more info, check out Michael Janke's adrenal/insulinoma web site: . Past FAIMLs are archived there, with a search feature, and there is a FAIML album featuring pictures of FAIML subscribers and their ferrets. FERRET CENTRAL WEBSITE and PAM GREENE's FERRET FAQs: Ferret Central Website is the grand intersection of ferret websites, at . You can also find the Ferret FAQs there, which include invaluable FAQs on insulinoma and adrenal diseases. I forward these two FAQs to all new subscribers, and will gladly send them upon request. I also send the "Disease Package", a file that tells how to get all six of Pamela Greene's FAQs on ferret diseases. Pam also has excellent FAQ's about general ferret care. FERRET MAILING LIST (FML): The FML has 3,000+ ferret-loving subscribers and the topic is simply ferrets, ferrets, and more ferrets. Moderated by Mr. Bill Gruber, it's a great source of ferret entertainment and information. Visit FERRET CENTRAL on the web (see paragraph above) for more info on the FML. To subscribe to the FML, send email to its moderator, Bill Gruber, at and ask to be added. You can also try subscribing automatically by sending email to with the command SUBSCRIBE FERRET in the body of the email. Date: Sat, 14 Oct 2000 19:15:04 -0400 From: "Lisa J. Rodriguez" Northern NJ vet needed ASAP i just got a call from a local friend whose parents live in northern NJ and have a ferret who is having some problems. the vet they go to told them that 'the ferret is full of stones the whole way up and there is no hope' (at least this is what i got after it traveled to me - think of that party game played by kids at sleepovers.) i'm sorry i don't have more info than that. i told my friend to tell them not to panic and that we could find some info for them - so could someone please give me a couple of vet contact options for them in the northern NJ area? at least then i could rest knowing they had seen a vet who was recomended by ferret owners, not just the guy they see for their dog. please send info to me at rufina@sbccom.com if you would please. thank you... lisa j. MODERATOR'S NOTE: Hi. This message was sent out individually a couple days ago, but is being included in the next list as usual. Replies are posted below at the end of the list. I haven't heard the results yet, but a fair amount of options were certainly sent along. Let us know how it goes, okay Lisa? I sure hope the little fur baby gets some help in time. Lynn Date: Sun, 15 Oct 2000 06:50:00 -0700 (PDT) From: "Kelly Cameron" Cardiomyopathy and insulinoma post Hi, After reading the post about Cokie, I thought I would ask about people's experiences in dealing with insulinoma in a ferret with cardiomyopathy. A 5 year old male came into our shelter a few weeks ago in terrible condition. His biggest problem is cardiomyopathy. His last two blood sugars have come back in the 50's, so I assume he probably has insulinoma too. What I am worried about is putting him on pred, because we are having a really hard time eliminating the fluid retention in his belly and around his lungs. Will the pred make this worse? Thanks for your help and good luck to everyone's little buddies! Julie P.S. Lynn, I see squares too. Date: Sat, 14 Oct 2000 18:19:36 EDT From: SBrown9530@aol.com Adrenal Question I have a little girl, will be 4 in March, who has "rat tail" with every coat change. Took her to the vet today because of "mushy", smelly poops, altho not the consistency/color/smell of ECE. I've also noticed that her nipples are a tiny bit more prominate and harder than the other girls. During the exam the vet stated he could feel some mammary tissue that felt different around the nipples and an enlarged right adrenal. Also stated "rat tail" is an early sign of adrenal. Is this true? This little girl is a rescue, along with 6 other rescues. IF "rat tail" is an early sign of adrenal, then it would appear I'm looking at 3 more rescues with adrenal. Yes, she's had blackheads on her tail, fur will grow back in, then get sparse again. Dr. Murray, in your experience, is "rat tail" an early sign of adrenal? Sandi Date: Sat, 14 Oct 2000 08:36:28 -0500 From: "Sue Stout" Jonesy Hi everyone, Just wanted to update you on Jonesy. I decided NOT to give him the Proglycem. He would go unresponsive each time I gave it to him regardless of the dosage. I even tried giving just 1 drop! I have been making sure he is getting 4 supplemental feedings of Hills AD per day (have everyone in the family now involved!), and he gets his Pred 0.5ml twice a day. He has been more active, occasionally playful, and seems to be better. We go next week for another blood sugar test. I wanted to thank everyone one of you who assisted me when I was so upset, worried and desperate. I don't think we could get through this without your support and advice. Sue and Jonesy Date: Mon, 16 Oct 2000 23:15:29 -0400 From: "Steve Fontneau" Proglycem and Pred. regarding insulinoma: i have had better luck with giving my zoey the proglycem than the pred. she is 6 yrs old and has had the disease for 3 yrs. we have had several progressions. at first we treated her with diet, then pred. she did get pred belly . that went down somewhat when we switched to the proglycem. the dose was too high at first. we didn`t know, the vet and i , exactly what would work. he recomended both. and i did as told but zoey lost her appetite and had lethargic moments and some frightening panting and dragging herself around running into things spells. finally we took her off the pred completely and lowered the pro dose also. that was the right thing to do. her appetite came back and her energy. she was her old self again, for about 2 months , then she had drooling and pawing again, so i upped the dosage of the proglycem. now after almost 2 years of meds, she does well, but i have to feed her bob`s chicken gravy every 2 to 3 hours, day and night and her med schedule is every 6 hours. the vet says it will get to be every 2 hours sometime. i have no life and i never sleep. but she is worth it. she is the dearest , sweetest ferret and most perfect friend i have ever met. p.s i also have 2 other ferrets and have lost 5 friends in the past 5 years from every cancer possible. its a long journey and i`m very glad to have ferret pals on the internet. thanks. cindy and the 3 furballs. Date: Mon, 16 Oct 2000 07:18:19 -0400 From: "Dale Nupp" Update on Odo Hello All: Well I finally took Odo to the vet and he confirmed adrenal disease. Of course, all of you already knew that and advised me appropriately:o) My vet wants me to get some more weight on his bones before he goes in. I feel bad for Odo since he just had insulinoma surgery in April. At that time, my vet said the adrenals looked fine and that adrenal disease can show up in six months. I guess six months is a long time in a ferrets life. I talked about surgery vs. medication and my vet thinks Odo is a good candidate for surgery. However, my vet has never used medications such as Lupron. I printed all of the articles on Mike Janke's website by Drs. Murray and Weiss that deal with medication. My very great thanks to those fine vets for helping my vet to become a better Dr. for my fuzzies. Of course, thanks to Mike for making the information accessible. BTW, someone asked what they feed their sick fuzzies and Mike responded that he uses AD and chicken baby food. It turns out I use the identical formula. Great minds think alike I guess LOL. I'll let you know how the surgery goes; not yet scheduled. Dale Date: Sun, 15 Oct 2000 06:47:39 +0000 From: Linda.Doran@att.net Chicken baby food and glucose levels Like Michael F. Janke, I give chicken baby food to augment my ferrets' diets if necessary. They always seem to like it, even if they're hesitant at first, after they get some rubbed on their noses (as Dr. Williams has recommended). Higher protein intake helps to regulate glucose levels when they're low (this is true of humans like myself as well as ferrets). This is why I'm giving chicken baby food to Lucky Charm in-between meals, because even though her appetite is still good, her glucose levels are dropping again. I heat the chicken baby food to lukewarm in the microwave (which only takes about eight seconds), stir it real good and make sure it's not too hot, and she laps it up. Sometimes I have to put extra helpings in her bowl because she gets competition from her two brothers, Chocolate Moose & Zipper, who have decided they like chicken baby food, too. Dr. Weiss recommended feeding Lucky Charm more often (with high-protein foods) to help keep her glucose levels up. Lucky Charm will get a second partial pancreatectomy when Dr. Weiss visits New Mexico, where he will be hosted by Dr. Michael Treitler in Santa Fe and will demonstrate cryosurgery for adrenal ferrets. You should see the beautiful fur coat Lucky Charm grew after getting a Lupron injection to counteract overactive, ectopic adrenal tissue following two adrenalectomies! She's an amazing girl (and as some of you know, she is the founder of the ferret union, CHAOS - - Creating Havoc And Other Silliness). :-) Good luck to all ferrets and their humans. Linda, Lucky Charm, Chocolate Moose, & Zipper Date: Mon, 16 Oct 2000 16:17:26 EDT From: Anonymous CA Vet: no luck finding in Bay area yet... So far no luck, and the one recommeded is really far away. Bandit doesn't do good on car rides and that is over an hour away. Thank you for all your help. I'm also going to try the local ferret groups out here and see if they know of anyone. (so there is hope :O) ) Date: Sun, 15 Oct 2000 02:42:23 +0000 From: Linda.Doran@att.net Northern NJ vet needed ASAP We don't know any vets in northern New Jersey, but maybe this person could drive to the D.C. area to see Dr. Weiss in Maryland. We hope you find a vet. Please warn that ferret that a vet in that vicinity will probably have a Joisey accent. Lucky Charm, Chocolate Moose, & Zipper crossing our paws for you owners of Linda Date: Sun, 15 Oct 2000 01:24:36 -0400 From: "Judith White" Northern NJ vet needed ASAP I don't know if any of these are northern New Jersey. I think Fuzztek is. Anyway, here are some NJ shelters and the vets they use. Perhaps someone on the list can be of help. Blessings Judith ************************************************************ NEW JERSEY ************************************************************ Yvonne DeCarlo, Fuzztek@aol.com Dr. Paul Kim Anne Ryan, Ducklite@aol.com Ridgefield Park Animal Hospital Fuzztek North and Central 215 Main Street 1106 Johnson Court Ridgefield Park, NJ 07660 New Milford, NJ 07646 201-814-0095 (201) 836-8682 127 Aspen Drive North Brunswick, NJ 08902 (732) 398-0132 ************************************************************ Denise & Rick Jackson Dr. Michael Doolen Denise@ferrethollow.org Avian & Exotic Hospital of Oakhurst Rick@ferrethollow.org 225 Monmouth Road Ferret Hollow Shelter & Rescue Oakhurst, NJ 07755 129 W. Westside Avenue 732-531-1212 Red Bank, NJ 07701-1463 *indicate donations are for 732-345-9278 Ferret Hollow www.ferrethollow.org ************************************************************ Steve Reznick Michael J. Weiss D.V.M. ferret@tamart.com All Creatures Veterinary Care Center SJ Ferret Sanctuary 352 Greentree Road 59 Berlin Road Sewell, NJ 08080 Gibbsboro, NJ 08026 (609) 256-8996 (609) 784-6789 www.tamart.com/sr.html ************************************************************ Kim Rushing & Stan Sikorski Dr. Stephen Levinson kistaferret@exit109.com Barnegat Animal Clinic KiSta Ferret Rescue 530 N. Main Street 215 East Bay Avenue Unit 22 Barnegat, NJ 08005 Manahawkin, NJ 08050 609-698-2141 609-978-8588 609-978-5899 www.kistaferret.com Date: Mon, 16 Oct 2000 06:54:13 EDT From: Ducklite@aol.com Northern NJ vet needed ASAP Dr. Paul Kim at Ridgefield Park Animal Hospital is a ferret specialist. The office is at 215 Main St in Ridgefield Park. The number is 201-814-0095. He had done many surgeries for the removal of stones, and has saved many ferrets that other vets have said were hopeless cases. Of his 5 office staff, three are ferret owners--a very ferret friendly group :-) Anne Date: Sun, 15 Oct 2000 20:11:25 EDT From: EquineAmy@aol.com Northern NJ vet needed ASAP In Oradell NJ, right next to Paramus, there is an emergency vet hospital - I don't have the number on hand, but htey have a web site. IT is Oradell Animal Hospital Caring For Pets & Exotic Animals When I had a problem with my ferrets vet - (he didn't call me back after three days of constant calls - he kept having a tech call me back) I then called Oradell cause I couldn't wait anymore. I madea n appt with a vet there, but not the specialist - he was booked solid, but when I was in the room, in walks Dr. Boren, the speicalist - he rearranged soem stuff so that he could see my Winnie - he is very nice and sat with me for a while explaining the entire disease. Call them, but please keep in mind that they do have many emergencies so sometimes there is a bit of a wait but nothing terrible -but if you were the one who needed the vet ASAP, you would h ope that people would be patient too. good luck and if I can help anymore, please let me know. Amy ----------------------- End of FAIML #473 ------------------------